00:20 <@matches> I only saw it because it is also outside an #ifdef and raises an "unused label" warning
00:20 <@matches> How many others are there...
00:24 <@matches> There is also a goto in stb_truetype.h but I'll let that one slide since sulix didn't write it
+10:01 < sulix> Gah: runs fine, no warnings in valgrind, crashed with memory corruption errors outside of valgrind.
+10:02 < sulix> This is clearly karmic retribution for the goto.
+10:25 <@matches> Ah
+10:25 <@matches> Are you compiling with or without the quadtree?
+10:25 <@matches> Because I set the VReal and PReal typedef to ParanoidNumber
+10:26 <@matches> Running in valgrind ParanoidNumber is equivelant to a double since the FE_INEXACT exception isn't raised
+10:26 <@matches> Running outside of valgrind... anything could happen
+11:31 <@matches> One does not simply compile with MinGW and have things actually work
+11:32 <@matches> Wine likes it
+11:32 <@matches> Actual windows seems to have some difficulty with OpenGL functions
+11:32 <@matches> Also thank goodness for gdb compiled for windows
+11:33 <@matches> Because "ipdf.exe has experienced an error, would you like to send Microsoft a report?"
+11:33 <@matches> Is really not helpful
+11:33 <@matches> Command prompt won't even tell you "Segmentation fault"
+11:39 <@matches> Hmm, needs more "-lopengl32" ?
+11:39 <@matches> But why weren't there "undefined reference" errors
+11:39 <@matches> So confuzled
+11:40 <@matches> I bet even if it runs it won't work due to geometry shaders or something
+11:49 <@matches> Oh dear
+11:49 <@matches> This is to do with the several thousand lines of autogenerated stuff in gl_core44.*
+11:50 <@matches> Isn't this what GLEW was supposed to be for
+11:50 <@matches> Except GLEW is ancient so nobody uses it
+11:50 <@matches> Shouldn't someone reinvent a less shitty GLEW then
+11:50 < sulix> Apparently glew works again.
+11:50 <@matches> Ah
+11:51 < sulix> I did get glew working under mingw32 yesterday, as it happens.
+11:51 <@matches> Commit please?
+11:51 <@matches> Oh right for something else :P
+11:51 <@matches> What magical incantations are required
+11:51 < sulix> Yeah. And by working, I mean compiling, not running.
+11:51 <@matches> Baha
+11:52 < sulix> (Though I think it was another bit of the code that segfaulted)
+11:52 <@matches> Why is getting OpenGL working so horrifying
+11:52 <@matches> It's supposed to be a standard
+11:52 < sulix> So the gl_core44.* file was supposed to be basically glew, but hooked into SDL.
+11:52 <@matches> It's not working on Windows though
+11:53 < sulix> Do you have OpenGL drivers on windows?
+11:53 < sulix> They're not installed by default.
+11:53 <@matches> Yeah on my desktop
+11:53 <@matches> Although I did switch to Maaxen
+11:53 < sulix> Hmmm...
+11:53 <@matches> There were other things wrong
+11:53 <@matches> I wasn't liking with -lopengl32
+11:54 <@matches> Although wine didn't seem to care
+11:54 < sulix> In theory, the glcore44 and SDL stuff should load opengl32 at runtime if needed.
+11:54 < sulix> So you shouldn't, in theory, need to link to them.
+11:54 < sulix> But that's very much "in theory".
+11:55 <@matches> I will investigate the driver situation on Maaxen
+11:55 <@matches> Urgh why can't windows just have `apt-cache search`
+11:55 <@matches> And `lspci | grep vga`
+11:55 <@matches> Lets see... "Device Manager"
+11:55 < sulix> Maaxen will almost certainly not have working GL 3+ drivers.
+11:56 <@matches> Oh it's a VM
+11:56 * matches backs away very quickly
+11:56 <@matches> Well I can't keep rebooting every time I try and fix a segfault
+11:56 <@matches> Bloody scope broke my other laptop
+11:57 <@matches> I used to have Windows XP...
+11:57 <@matches> Oh wait I smashed the hard drive open so I could draw it for an assignment
+11:58 < sulix> You should subscribe to the "if it works under wine, it's good enough" philosophy.
+11:58 * sulix has shipped things that way.
+12:00 < sulix> Anyway, the quadtree is still segfaulting when not run under valgrind by (I think) getting the video card to somehow corrupt unrelated system memory or something.
+12:00 <@matches> :S
+12:01 < sulix> It always crashes when trying to glDeleteBuffers() which is really disturbing.
+12:02 <@matches> I've noticed that when there are a lot of objects, and you kill the program, you never get the memory back ever
+12:02 <@matches> And your system stays slow
+12:02 <@matches> Which is a bit of a problem
+12:02 <@matches> Need to reboot every hour or so of testing...
+12:02 < sulix> Okay, I haven't had that happen.
+12:02 <@matches> I guess that's just fglrx amazingness
+12:03 < sulix> Guess so.
+12:03 <@matches> For example, I can run turtles_all_the_way_down.script without anything crashing but then I am left with like 20MB and when I open Iceweasel everything goes to hell
+12:03 < sulix> On the bright side, the fglrx developers are planning to get rid of the fglrx kernel module and just have their closed-source GL driver talk to the open-source kernel driver.
+12:04 <@matches> Is that... good
+12:04 < sulix> We'll see, but I can't imagine it making fglrx _worse_
+12:04 <@matches> The open source driver doesn't work that well either
+12:05 <@matches> I sense another few days trying to get X working again after an `apt-get upgrade` at some point in the future then :(
+12:08 < sulix> Don't worry, they're still in the "have meetings" phase.
+12:37 <@matches> I think the glDebug stuff is giving windows issues
+12:37 <@matches> At least running in actual windows not a VM
+12:37 <@matches> Running in a VM is not conductive to working
+12:37 <@matches> Sanity tells me to give up
+12:38 <@matches> It can do glCreateProgram though!
+12:38 <@matches> glObjectLabel seems broken
+12:39 < Pommers> http://th01.deviantart.net/fs70/PRE/i/2012/076/1/2/oh_my_glob__by_tsubasaangel-d4t0g68.jpg Oh my glOb
+12:39 <@matches> Yes
+12:40 <@matches> It would be nice if the extension manager (if you could call gl_core44 that?) used stubs instead of NULL
+12:41 <@matches> I mean for debugging
+12:41 <@matches> Then you can have it print "This function doesn't actually exist guys"
+12:41 <@matches> gdb is nicer I supose
+12:41 <@matches> In fact if I weren't trying to cross compile on linux and then reboot and test in windows this would be a lot easier
+12:58 <@matches> Ok screw this
+12:58 <@matches> I need to write a thesis
+12:58 <@matches> :(
+12:58 <@matches> But after lunch
+13:51 <@matches> http://thecodelesscode.com/case/57
+14:12 < Pommers> Lunch sounds good
+14:23 <@matches> I'm currently reading codelesscode using the excuse that the turtles tester takes a very long time to sigfpe
+14:23 <@matches> (But it sigfpe's nonetheless)
+14:24 <@matches> Can we disable sigfpe for overflow/underflow casts from double to float
+14:24 <@matches> That would make things easier
+14:24 <@matches> Well
+14:24 <@matches> Assuming that the float casts to FLT_MAX or FLT_MIN if it would underflow/overflow
+16:09 <@matches> sulix: I can no longer load anything into the document
+16:09 <@matches> Congratulations though, this means it always renders accurately...
+16:20 <@matches> Ok...
+16:20 <@matches> We now have
+16:20 <@matches> #ifdef
+16:20 <@matches> ...
+16:21 <@matches> m_count++;
+16:21 <@matches> return m_count;
+16:21 <@matches> #else
+16:21 <@matches> return m_count++;
+16:21 <@matches> #endif
+16:22 <@matches> Because I don't know if the quadtree *needs* to return an invalid array index (it doesn't even use the same array...) but over in monotree land we like our array indices to be valid
+16:24 <@matches> Now what was I doing
+16:24 <@matches> Ah, seeing if OpenGL really could do Wu lines
+16:25 <@matches> So when I say it is in my report I am not lying
+16:25 <@matches> Report...
+16:25 <@matches> The thing I'm writing
+16:25 <@matches> Write
+16:25 < Pommers> How long is the report going to be matches?
+16:25 < Pommers> And when are you going to finish it?
+16:25 <@matches> It has to be 6000 words
+16:26 <@matches> My LitReview is ~8000 ...
+16:26 <@matches> Although that might be including the SVG and postscript examples
+16:26 <@matches> I think I should take those out?
+16:26 <@matches> You'd think having a huge pre-written document would make it easier but no
+16:27 <@matches> Enabling LINE_SMOOTH leads to, of all things, SIGFPE
+18:25 <@matches> I am making a whole lot of no progress here
+18:25 <@matches> Draft due on Friday...
+18:26 <@matches> I need to produce a Design Process
+18:26 <@matches> The software wasn't so much designed as congealed
+18:27 <@matches> I forgot this is an Engineering Project not CS and therefore needs to be done in such a way that future Engineers can improve upon the work...
+18:27 * matches sobs some more
+18:27 <@matches> Rectangles and Circles don't even work anymore
+18:28 <@matches> I sacrificed them for the glory of the Bezier To Path transformations
+18:29 <@matches> Also, instead of a transformation per path, it would make more sense to use one per SVG
+18:30 <@matches> It's basically the localised coordinate approach but not as fancy as a quadtree
+18:30 <@matches> If you were building up a document one bezier at a time by drawing them, you'd have to do something fancy to make your paths
+18:31 <@matches> (Un)Fortunately we don't have an editor anyway
+18:47 <@matches> Hmm, that really needs reverse parenthesis to indicate that the word is "Unfortunately" but the "Un" is removed
+18:47 <@matches> )Un(Fortunately
+18:47 <@matches> I have invented a new gramatical construct-thing
+18:47 * matches adds it to the list of results
+--- Day changed Mon Oct 06 2014
+18:02 <@matches> So the good news is I worked out the transform, the bad news is it's yet another horrible hack
+18:03 <@matches> Which will undoubtably be extremely slow if I use Gmprat
+19:01 <@matches> It's amazing how useful a "grid.svg" that is just lines which should in theory be one pixel apart is
+19:01 <@matches> If we could draw it in a different colour it would be even more useful
+19:01 <@matches> But the clock of doom is counting down to the epsilon of time
+19:17 <@matches> A quick bit of <commenting out large parts of the shading algorithm and enabling shading anyway> later: http://szmoore.net/ipdf/fox-vector+grid.png
+19:20 <@matches> Wow that took 16 minutes
+19:20 <@matches> ... 19 if you count the last 3...
+19:20 <@matches> I'm running out of epsilons
+19:21 <@matches> If I represent the amount of time I have left on the project as a floating point number, then a single second is below the epsilon for floats, therefore each second will not affect the amount of time I have left, therefore I will never have to finish
+19:21 * matches resists the urge to verify if a single second is actually below epsilon or not
+--- Day changed Tue Oct 07 2014
+13:52 <@matches> http://ieeexplore.ieee.org.ezproxy.library.uwa.edu.au/stamp/stamp.jsp?tp=&arnumber=5577902
+13:52 <@matches> Uh oh
+13:57 < sulix> We did look at that briefly, IIRC, but ignored it because it was only integers, I think.
+16:05 <@matches> Yeah, although a rational is just two integers
+16:05 <@matches> But too late now
+16:05 <@matches> I am not making progress
+16:05 <@matches> I have deleted words
+16:05 <@matches> That is not progress
+16:05 <@matches> (I had 8000 words, I require 6000 words...)
+16:06 <@matches> I should probably get some performance tests done, but every time I try there ends up being something I have to code first
+17:25 <@matches> I have a somewhat less awful explanation of number representations that still manages to carefully not actually define a number
+17:26 <@matches> I wonder if I need a citation though
+17:28 <@matches> Does it classify as "blindingly obvious" or "known since the dawn of time" that you can write numbers as "\sum_{i=-\infty}^{\infty} d_i B^i" where "d_i" and B are also numbers (it's so meta)
+17:28 <@matches> You're the maths guy, surely there is a paper
+17:29 <@matches> If it's blindingly obvious, I probably shouldn't state it, so I guess it's not blindingly obvious...
+17:29 <@matches> But on the other hand it's just a fancy way of talking about what you learn in primary school...
+17:43 <@matches> http://thecodelesscode.com/case/137
+17:50 <@matches> Dear goodness it's hideous
+20:08 < sulix> matches: It's actually kind-of more complicated than that.
+20:08 < sulix> You might find it interesting to look up Cantor's diagonal argument.
+20:09 < sulix> (Which is technically a proof that the size of the set of rationals is different to the size of the set of reals, but it uses the idea of infinite sequences of digits)
+20:09 < sulix> For example \sum_{i=-\infty}^{\infty} d_i B^i actually gives you the reals, not the rationals.
+20:10 < sulix> But you have to be super-careful about what "infinity" is.
+21:11 <@matches> Did I say Rational
+21:11 <@matches> I thought I said real
+21:11 <@matches> No I said "number"
+21:11 <@matches> Wel
+21:12 <@matches> I will look up Cantor's diagonal bishop
+21:12 <@matches> I mean argument
+21:13 <@matches> But basically anything you are going to represent on a computer is either written as that sum or based on components that are
+21:13 <@matches> A float is like changing where the "0" is
+21:13 <@matches> An integer is starting the sum from zero
+21:14 <@matches> An arbitrary integer uses the same sum, but the digits are smaller integers
+21:14 <@matches> (In another base, and then the base of the arbitrary integer is 2^{N})
+21:14 <@matches> I don't know how much I am expected to explain this sort of thing
+21:15 <@matches> And of course a rational is two integers written using the sum
+21:15 <@matches> Infinity is...
+21:16 <@matches> Yeah
+21:17 <@matches> Screw that, if people don't like me writing a number as an infinite sequence of digits I will point out the name of my major (and then hope they don't ask why I am doing a project about numbers considering my major)
+21:17 <@matches> Other things I don't really want to include in my report are the 4 operations for floats
+21:18 <@matches> But I feel like some sort of explanation of why "(x - view.x) / view.w" totally dies
+21:18 <@matches> Is needed
+21:18 <@matches> I'll commit "grid.svg", you might find it useful
+21:18 < sulix> "If view.w is zero, you're in trouble."
+21:18 <@matches> Yeah
+21:19 < sulix> I'm sure grid.svg will lead me to much confusion!
+21:19 <@matches> No it's really cool
+21:19 <@matches> It is a 1px by 1px grid
+21:19 < sulix> But how will I know where I am?
+21:19 <@matches> So, because we add SVGs scaled to the view, whenever you insert it the view should be black
+21:19 <@matches> Ah
+21:20 <@matches> But if you zoom in, you can resolve the lines that are 1px apart in the original view
+21:20 * sulix really needs to get on that "adding SVGs scaled to the view" thing.
+21:21 <@matches> So, if you add it scaled to the view at some point and you *don't* see total blackness, it's showing you the locations in the document that can be represented when scaled to the view
+21:21 <@matches> ... If that makes any sense
+21:22 < sulix> Ah.... that's cool.
+21:22 <@matches> For example using single precision, at {5,5,1e-6,1e-6} you only get 4 lines (and also, the distance between the lines is the amount you need to move the mouse in order to translate)
+21:22 <@matches> Yeah, and hopefully it will be good for my bounds measurement test
+21:23 <@matches> I know it's a shitty measure but it's better than just saying "This picture looks funny!"
+21:23 <@matches> "This graph indicates how funny a picture will look"
+21:23 <@matches> I feel like graphs make things *look* more legitimate even if they aren't actually
+--- Day changed Wed Oct 08 2014
+12:48 <@matches> Writing up these "results" it really doesn't feel like I've achieved much of consequence...
+12:49 <@matches> It feels like I spent 9.5 months not understanding anything and then stumbled accross the blindingly obvious solution that should have taken a week.
+12:50 <@matches> Then again, we were talking about local vs global coordinate systems right at the start...
+12:51 <@matches> Anyway all I've done is introduce a local coordinate system which is expressed with arbitrary precision relative to the global coordinate system.
+12:51 <@matches> The only advantage I can see with the quadtree is that it clips things
+12:51 <@matches> Which is admittedly a really huge advantage
+12:51 <@matches> Since GMP rationals grow exponentially...
+12:51 <@matches> It's a very big time constant thanks to GCD though
+12:52 <@matches> I wish shading worked because these figures would look so much more awesome with colour
+12:57 <@matches> I really hate that I can't just include a pixel perfect copy of the png figures
+12:58 <@matches> There's a massive amount of antialiasing going on
+13:01 <@matches> ...
+13:01 <@matches> I've been writing too much LaTeX when I start using '%' as comment in our debug script
+22:57 <@matches> I must say, the one place where PDF's magical blurring of things makes them look better is the figures from back when shading almost worked
+22:57 < Pommers> LaTeX <3
+22:57 <@matches> It's not even something you can control in LaTeX
+22:58 <@matches> The PDF viewer will do whatever the hell it wants
+22:58 <@matches> Although I've realised that the screenshot tool in debian is also adding antialiasing of its own
+22:59 <@matches> So at some point between the draft thesis and the final thesis I guess I need to go through IPDF's own screenshot function
+22:59 <@matches> szmoore.net/ipdf/sam/presentation/presentation.pdf
+23:00 <@matches> The presentation with a big gap where I in theory explain Rational numbers, arbitrary precision integers, the GMP library, Why we only care about the bounds of beziers, the different ways you can apply bounds transforms to get better results, and all the graphs that I am going to make that don't exist yet
+23:00 < Pommers> Oh yeah, did you see the Github pack that I posted in #UCC last night?
+23:00 <@matches> Well no I was too busy crying myself to sleep
+23:01 <@matches> Thesis' are harder than regular assignments mainly because there isn't a set goal
+23:01 <@matches> You have to set your own goal
+23:01 < Pommers> https://education.github.com/pack
+23:02 <@matches> And it tends to end up as not actually thinking about the goal until the end and then realising that you didn't meet it
+23:02 <@matches> Huh what's that
+23:03 <@matches> I see many "cloud" and "crowdsourcing" references and "$" signs
+23:03 < Pommers> All free stuff for students
+23:04 <@matches> Cool
+23:04 <@matches> Goodnight
+23:04 < Pommers> Night
+23:06 <@matches> Hmm, I should probably have removed the Western Australian Marine Science Institution logo from that presentation template I stole
+23:07 <@matches> Or it will haunt my dreams
+23:07 < Pommers> Probably. Whena re you presenting?
+23:10 < sulix> I'm just disappointed that your presentation isn't "CONFIDENTIAL" like some of th others on the list.
+23:17 < Pommers> Nice presentation
+--- Day changed Thu Oct 09 2014
+09:22 <@matches> I'm kind of worried that my live demo takes about 10 minutes to run
+09:23 <@matches> Also there are so many things that don't work
+09:23 <@matches> Like actually loading an SVG with arbitrary precision
+09:24 <@matches> The bottleneck in the live demo seems to be the shear number of objects in it though
+09:24 <@matches> Maybe I just need fewer turtles
+09:25 <@matches> Also is Rowan in Perth
+09:25 <@matches> I think he might be supposed to mark it
+09:26 <@matches> Although they listed Tim and not Rowan on the supervisors list
+09:26 <@matches> :S(
+10:43 < sulix> Rowan is here.
+10:50 <@matches> Excellent
+10:50 <@matches> "Record yourself presenting as practice" they said "It will make you feel more confident" they said
+10:51 <@matches> They never mentioned that it will make you realise just how stupid your voice sounds, just how boring you are at presenting, and just how many things you don't have time to cover
+10:51 <@matches> Well that last one I guess they did mention
+10:51 <@matches> They didn't mention the crushing despair...
+10:59 * sulix is in desperate need for a suitably punny title for his seminar.
+11:17 <@matches> I didn't use a pun
+11:17 <@matches> I used a very mundane title
+11:17 <@matches> Which is probably why I am on last...
+11:17 <@matches> Whoops I'm not supposed to give Pommers hints as to when it is, or he might show up
+11:22 <@matches> I make such a leap in my presentation
+11:22 <@matches> I go from "Look this PDF viewer has a zoom limit of 800%" to "The standards specify IEEE-754 floats"
+11:22 <@matches> Quietly ignoring that you really should be able to go further than 800% with IEEE-754 floats
+11:22 < sulix> Sounds good!
+11:23 <@matches> I guess if someone calls me out I have the backup "Look, I can zoom further but then X crashes"
+11:23 <@matches> "What a shame, looks like I can't do the rest of the presentation!"
+11:23 <@matches> Also
+11:23 <@matches> Where am I supposed to mention the collaborative aspect
+11:24 < sulix> Just point at me and go: "the bugs are all his fault".
+11:24 <@matches> Currently it is in "References"
+11:24 <@matches> - David did things
+11:24 <@matches> - Go see David talk about Quadtrees
+11:25 < sulix> - He used a goto, get the pitchforks.
+11:27 <@matches> "So I'm going to do some live demos now"
+11:27 <@matches> "And as you can see, if I zoom in
+11:27 <@matches> "Oh fuck SIGFPE"
+11:29 <@matches> Also, if you have any time to set up some of the performance tests that would be kind of awesome
+11:29 <@matches> Since we both need them, but I appear to need them sooner :P
+11:30 <@matches> I guess I can leave them out and just have the spots in the draft where I want them to go, but I'm getting exponentially nervous about them
+11:30 <@matches> We can compile with MPFR C++ mpreal now
+11:30 <@matches> You can set the precision, but it appears to be fixed
+11:30 < sulix> Oooh...
+11:31 < sulix> Is it faster that gmprat?
+11:31 <@matches> I don't know yet
+11:31 <@matches> That's one of the performance tests I want to do
+11:32 <@matches> I think mpreal with a fancy algorithm for how you increase precision *might* beat GMP rat
+11:32 < sulix> So do I.
+11:32 <@matches> The problem is, if you use a fixed precision then you can always choose some view bounds for which things aren't rendered correctly
+11:32 <@matches> Also I do not have time to implement a fancy algorithm for how you increase precision...
+11:33 <@matches> I feel like I have achieved half of the project
+11:33 <@matches> Rather than the whole thing
+11:33 <@matches> :S
+11:34 <@matches> I do suspect that if you just go "I will use a 1000 bits" for mpreal, then for ranges where you don't need that precision you're wasting a lot of time
+11:36 < sulix> You can't do "I'll use n*zoom bits" or something?
+11:37 <@matches> I think I would be better off analysing the implementation that works rather than implementing the implementation that might work better...
+11:37 <@matches> I guess there's still some time *after* the presentation
+11:44 <@matches> sulix: People are getting lunch at the tav because it's Pommer's birthday, you should come
+11:45 <@matches> I went in the tav once and didn't die
+11:45 <@matches> (Not counting the quiz night, at which I'm pretty sure I did die)
+11:45 < sulix> I guess I could eat some lunch.
+18:32 <@matches> I have pushed the horrible python/debugscript combo
+18:32 <@matches> Featuring totally inconsistent naming conventions in the python scripts
+18:36 <@matches> I do recommend you learn how to use python for horrible hacky scripts like this because it is about to save my life
+18:38 <@matches> Maybe you can write one that demonstrates the flaw by zooming in on an intersection :P
+18:39 <@matches> Hmm
+18:39 <@matches> I wonder if the use of "cin" and "stdout" for input to the DebugScript and output from the DebugScript does anything wierd
+18:40 <@matches> Conshmistency
+18:40 * matches goes into super draft mode
+--- Log closed Thu Oct 09 18:40:43 2014
+--- Log opened Thu Oct 09 18:41:03 2014
+18:41 -!- Irssi: #ipdf: Total of 3 nicks [0 ops, 0 halfops, 0 voices, 3 normal]
+18:41 -!- Irssi: Join to #ipdf was synced in 0 secs
+18:41 < matches> (You might say something important that I overlooked I guess?)
+19:47 < sulix> Okay, so the grid is totally breaking the quadtree.
+19:47 < sulix> Because it has lines that coincide _exactly_ with the edge of the quadtree.
+19:48 < sulix> So the quadtree doesn't know what nodes to put them in.
+19:48 < sulix> Will there be two copies of them? Will there be none?
+19:48 < sulix> (Also you broke debugscript reading from a file, but I've fixed it and will push shortly)
+19:49 < sulix> (The power of iostreams!)
+20:00 < sulix> Okay, so not solving both the x and y cubics for vertical/horizontal lines didn't help.
+20:00 < sulix> (On the bright side, it doesn't seem to have broken anything too significant)
+20:19 < sulix> Interesting things from Knuth.
+20:20 < sulix> - "The origins of floating-point notation can be traced back to Babylonian mathematicians ~1800 BC" (who used bas 60, but didn't explicitly state the exponent)
+20:30 < sulix> - Bigints have O(N) addition/subtraction, multiplication/division O(N^2)
+20:32 < sulix> - Knuth writes the idea of "positional number systems" as (...a_3 a_2 a_1 a_0 . a_{-1} a_{-2} ...)_b = ... + a_3 b^3 + a_2 b^2 + a_1 b^1 + a_0 + a_{-1} b^{-1} + a_{-2} b^{-2} +...
+20:32 < sulix> i.e. neatly using "..." to avoid ever writing infinity.
+20:33 < sulix> He also uses the term "radix point" to mean decimal/binary/whatever point.
+20:33 < sulix> (and then gives about four pages of history of ancient civilisations counting)
+20:35 < sulix> There is then some discussion of negative and complex bases and the different ways of representing negatives.
+20:45 < sulix> - The "ulp" is a unit of floating-point error equal to one unit in the last place of the fraction (mantissa) part of a float.
+20:45 < sulix> Floating point operations are correct to within half an ulp.
+20:46 < sulix> The associative law for multiplication is holds within about 2 ulps.
+20:47 < sulix> (Provided no exponent overflow or underflow occurs)
+20:47 < matches> Cool
+20:47 < matches> Well, I've got a graph showing that mpfr reals with 6 bits of precision are (somewhat unsurprisingly) worse than either doubles or singles
+20:47 < matches> Also FPS
+20:47 < matches> FPS goes all over the place with everything
+20:48 < sulix> ulps are only valid for normalized floats.
+20:48 < sulix> Yeah, FPS is a totally terrible unit.
+20:49 < matches> SPF might be better
+20:49 < sulix> You should try for ms/frame, but even that will probably be a bit broken.
+20:50 < matches> FPS is in the code now, it can change later
+20:50 < matches> "This wobbly line is slightly lower than this one, indicating WORSE"
+20:50 < matches> Ok, what other performance tests did I need
+20:51 < matches> Oh yeah, ones that actually alter the view with things in it, as opposed to ones that import an svg at a fixed scale
+20:53 < matches> Man explaining how all these tests are actually valid will be a pain
+22:34 < matches> I am too tired to work out how to skip the tests that are essentially pointless for various transformation settings
+22:35 < matches> I guess they'll just be in the figures as straight lines thus proving my point
+22:35 < matches> (Or confusing the figure)
+22:35 < matches> The fact that there is a graph should be good enough for a draft
+22:36 < matches> Yes, they are straight lines, thus proving my point
+22:36 < matches> (Actually they just make the figure confusing)
+22:38 < matches> I think what I've actually invented is just a very convoluted way to demonstrate things that everyone has known since Knuth
+22:39 < matches> And less of a useful SVG viewer
+22:40 < matches> Either that or an epileptic siezure machine
+22:41 < matches> So many flashes
+22:42 < matches> Hmm it looks like the grid cumulated error is really not as noticable with the grid
+22:42 < matches> s/grid//
+22:42 < matches> s//grid/
+22:42 < matches> skdfjhasdf
+22:50 * matches prepares the "hairy fox" hypothesis
+22:58 < sulix> No relation to the hairy ball theorem? http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hairy_ball_theorem
+23:07 < matches> That is... an unfortunate name
+23:08 < matches> Oh, it turns out to produce the hairy fox you need to do a lot of cumulative transforms (dur)
+23:08 < matches> Not just two really big transforms
+23:08 < matches> So the ulp thing is useful
+23:08 < matches> For understanding the rounding errors for small widths
+23:10 < matches> The subtraction of x - v_x gives you up to 1 ulp and then the division by 1e-6 increases it to 1e6 ulp and if 1 ulp \approx 5e-5 or more, suddenly it is half your view width
+23:10 < matches> Increasing the exponent of (v_x, v_y) will double the ulp
+23:10 < matches> So for the same width you get half the precision
+23:20 < matches> Hairy fox syndrome appears to work best if you use pxzoom
+23:20 < matches> I won't question it...
+23:41 < matches> Yeah you have to try really hard to get the hairy fox
+23:42 < matches> My greatest fear is that someone will realise to achieve these "errors" by using the mouse (which is what it simulates) it would take you several days of determined scrolling
+23:42 < matches> Wow it makes interesting patterns in the grid though
+23:43 < matches> It affects both the position and the dimensions of the lines so your grid gradually disappears
+23:55 < sulix> pxzoom will have more error because it randomly calls expf() on its input, so you've got some dodgy approximation of 'e' messing things up.
+--- Day changed Fri Oct 10 2014
+00:16 < matches> Well that would have been nice to know before I ran a 20 minute test
+00:16 < matches> I thought it was equivelant to using the mouse
+00:17 < matches> Oh well
+00:17 < matches> The test still proves the point
+00:17 < matches> Even though there's the dodgy approximation of e going on
+00:17 < matches> GMP rationals give a very small error
+00:17 < matches> Cumulative transforms give a very large error
+00:17 < matches> Direct transforms give an increasing error and also have the issue with precision
+00:18 < matches> I should probably distinguish between error and precision a bit more
+00:18 < matches> We want precision and we don't want error
+00:19 < matches> So the GMP rationals applied to Path bounds pass both tests
+00:19 < matches> Whereas the other two approaches pass one test and fail the other
+00:19 < matches> Or fail both
+00:19 < matches> s/two/three/however many I had I lost count
+00:45 < matches> New draft is pushed
+00:45 < matches> Enjoy the graphs
+00:46 < matches> Try not to have too much fun questioning the validity of the results, they are all that's keeping me going
+00:46 < matches> I wish path-rat gave no error
+00:46 < Pommers> When do you need iPDF working on windows/
+00:47 < matches> It's not really a priority
+00:48 < matches> I'll probably try and get it working after the final report is due
+00:48 < matches> I will link to it anyway see
+00:49 < matches> The odds of anyone actually following the link are slim
+00:49 < matches> If it doesn't work I'll tell people to run it in wine
+09:33 < sulix> Those are damn nice graphs!
+09:34 < sulix> I take it there's no 'rat' measurement because it's too slow.
+09:35 < sulix> pxzoom is actually the same as the mouse, the mouse still does random expf() calls to work out the zoom amount.
+09:35 < sulix> (I thought I'd changed that, but apparently not)
+09:37 < sulix> Also, thank god we don't use 'sin': http://randomascii.wordpress.com/2014/10/09/intel-underestimates-error-bounds-by-1-3-quintillion/
+09:38 < matches> There should be a rat measurement?
+09:38 < matches> In the loss of precision graph, the path-rat program loses no precision
+09:39 < matches> But it's underneath all the other implementations that also lose no precision
+09:39 < matches> They are all on the same line...
+09:39 < matches> In the accumulated error graph, it is down near 10^{-2}
+09:39 < matches> I'm not sure why it isn't at zero...
+09:39 < matches> I'm just going to point vaguely at the expf function
+09:41 < matches> I'll probably add MPFR with 10 bits (half floats...) and X bits where X is a lot
+09:41 < matches> But not today
+09:41 < matches> My draft fleshes out a lot more when I uncomment things...
+09:41 < matches> I mean the idea of commenting them was that they'd be removed
+09:42 < matches> Also there are two sources of error in the Direct transformation
+09:42 < matches> I need to think about whether they are both equally bad or one is worse
+09:42 < matches> You need to apply the inverse view transformation to express the svg in document space
+09:43 < matches> *Then* you apply the view transformation to render it
+09:43 < matches> Either of those could be the one that breaks it, but I suspect the rendering transformation is worse
+09:46 < matches> Maybe some of the ipython figures don't have path-rat in them, I forget
+11:40 * sulix sighs.
+11:40 < sulix> cssubmit requires my abstract to be in ASCII, so the é in Bézier means cssubmit rejects it.
+11:51 < matches> Haha
+11:51 < matches> I got excited when Rowan said "Looks great to me" and then I realised he was talking about your abstract not my draft... :P
+11:52 < matches> That would have been impressive speed reading
+11:52 < matches> My abstract is sort of really terrible
+11:52 < matches> It clings to the whole "document formats" thing that the project was alledgedly about but has moved well away from
+11:53 < matches> It also promises that I'll compare arbitrary precision floats as well, so I guess I better hack something together with those...
+11:53 < matches> Maybe a graph showing how you can increase the precision but then the FPS goes down
+11:54 < sulix> That'd ve really good, actually.
+11:55 < matches> Yeah I think I did something similar for CQM once
+12:06 < matches> Hmm, I can probably hack together a CPU renderer only binary for windows
+12:06 < matches> He says, ignoring the tendency for the CPU renderer to shit itself and die
+12:07 < matches> It'd be a Cool Feature for it to fall back to the CPU renderer instead of just segfaulting
+12:08 < matches> Falling back to the backup renderer always sounds impressive
+12:08 < matches> Everyone loved it when HTR did that
+12:08 < matches> (And then I realised the "backup" renderer was actually better)
+12:17 < sulix> I've fixed (hopefully) the OpenGL version detection. It should now Fatal() when the driver doesn't have needed extensions.
+13:43 < sulix> Excellent: the é has gone through!
+--- Day changed Sat Oct 11 2014
+10:02 * sulix -> Perth Games Festival
+14:52 < Pommers> Is it good there?
+18:22 < matches> The "fix" to OpenGL version detection now means I don't have a valid version of OpenGL.
+18:23 < matches> It was working perfectly fine before
+18:24 * matches -> s/Fatal/Error/ and hopes it still works anyway
+18:25 < matches> Should you be setting the GL minor version to 1 and then failing if it isn't 3
+18:26 < matches> I am confused how this even works
+18:26 < matches> My OpenGL version is apparently 3.1 and the if statement apparently checks "IsVersion" 3.2
+18:26 < matches> And then says "We want 3.3"
+18:28 < matches> I get no error if I set the minor version attribute to 3
+18:28 < matches> So I take it we required 3.3 functions but were specifying that we only needed 3.1 or something
+18:28 < matches> And somehow the 3.3 functions still worked?
+18:29 < matches> Anyway, I'm in favour of the "Instead of terminating the program, report an error and then see whether it will crash anyway" approach
+18:29 < matches> If it *does* crash, then at least we warned them
+18:29 < matches> If it doesn't crash, hey it's running! Everyone wins!
+18:43 < matches> Using integer indices for different types of Real seemed like *such* a good idea at the time
+18:43 < matches> And then there was the ability to have up to three different types of Real...
+18:45 < matches> -std=c++11 -g -Wall -Werror -Wshadow -pedantic -rdynamic -I../contrib/include/SDL2 -I`pwd` -I/usr/share/qt4/mkspecs/linux-g++-64 -I. -I/usr/include/qt4/QtCore -I/usr/include/qt4/QtGui -I/usr/include/qt4 -I. -Itests -I. -DQT_NO_DEBUG -DQT_GUI_LIB -DQT_CORE_LIB -DREALTYPE=1 -DQUADTREE_DISABLED -DQT_NO_DEBUG -DQT_GUI_LIB -DQT_CORE_LIB -DTRANSFORM_OBJECTS_NOT_VIEW -DTRANSFORM_BEZIERS_TO_PATH -DPATHREAL=Gmprat -c -MMD
+18:45 < matches> Truly our Makefile is a thing of beauty
+18:47 < matches> It's so beautiful that there is now a Python function to invoke it with different arguments
+18:57 * matches stabs indentation errors
+18:59 < matches> "Unindent does not match any outer indentation level" What the fuck
+18:59 < matches> What the hell is an undindent
+18:59 < matches> It is pointing at a ':' character
+19:00 < matches> Oh
+19:00 < matches> It's because I copied it from ipython which magically converts your tabs to spaces
+19:00 < matches> And then tried to add things to it indenting with tabs
+19:01 < matches> I think it's a conspiracy to make the tabs vs spaces war even worse
+19:02 < matches> Now people have no option to compromise
+19:02 < matches> Or, in my case, use tabs where we bloody well typed tabs in the first place
+19:35 < matches> My clock says it's 3am, that's about how I feel...
+19:42 < matches> "Just use MPFR" is looking more and more likely to be the conclusion
+19:42 < matches> Wait...
+19:42 * matches eats hat
+19:43 < matches> Well, GMP rationals applied to path bounds is faster than mpfr with 1024 bits applied directly
+19:43 < matches> That's probably not a fair test though
+--- Day changed Sun Oct 12 2014
+14:53 < matches> Setting up the performance tests is a real pain if you want to actually include the really slow methods
+14:53 < matches> Well, restarting them can be painful
+14:54 < matches> Which means if you screw them up...
+14:58 < matches> Placing a limit of 30s per frame was perhaps a bit too generous
+15:05 < Pommers> THis is why you should use a build server
+15:05 < matches> Yeah except that's more effort to set up than it would save
+15:05 < matches> We even have one
+15:06 < matches> Motsugo could potentially run all these tests
+15:06 < matches> But it has to use a CPU renderer and is therefore shit
+15:06 < matches> Seeing the results in real time is a huge advantage
+15:06 * Pommers really needs to set up a proper Jenkins set up for UCC
+15:06 < matches> Oh, I'm not allowed to use my own laptop in the conference
+15:07 < matches> So if you want to fix the MinGW build for me... :P
+15:07 < matches> I'll see if sulix's magical GL version changes fixed anything later
+15:08 < matches> Ah
+15:08 < Pommers> I can give it a shot tonight. If you proof read some stuff for me right now
+15:08 < matches> I'm querying the FPS once the view has stopped being scaled
+15:08 < matches> Ok
+15:09 < matches> (I should record performance in the python script I think)
+15:09 < Pommers> tonight means after I finish work that is
+15:09 < matches> So 3am?
+15:09 < Pommers> Nah, like 6.30ish
+15:09 < matches> Honestly I'm probably just going to run a video
+15:10 < matches> But it'd be nice to say "Here's the binary with which you can reproduce the results"
+15:18 < matches> It's probably going to need to run on a Windows 95 presentation PC or something
+15:19 < matches> It has geometry shaders so it's probably beyond hope that it would work
+15:19 < matches> Hmm, do I need to prepare a response do a "Why didn't you just use <insert name of a language that isn't C++ here>"
+15:20 < matches> I seem to get that question every time I use C++ for anything
+15:20 < matches> Or alternately "Why didn't you use boost"
+16:19 < matches> sulix: What black magic should I do if I want to include the debug font in a screenshot...
+16:45 * matches resorts to ffmpeg instead
+16:45 < matches> With the disadvantage that 1 frame in a screen grap != 1 frame in the demo :(
+16:45 < matches> grap
+16:45 < matches> grape
+16:45 < matches> grab
+--- Day changed Tue Oct 14 2014
+00:17 -!- bobgeorge33 is now known as Pommers
+13:34 < matches> My presentation is tonight
+13:34 < matches> Looks like Tim is back just in time to watch it!
+14:50 < sulix> In order to break things at exactly the wrong moment, IPDF has a profiler now.
+14:50 < sulix> It dumps the time spent in various functions at the end of each frame.
+15:10 < matches> That's pretty awesome
+15:11 < matches> Ok, time to test this pdf in adobe reader...
+15:11 < matches> And scream if it doesn't work
+15:19 * matches screams
+15:20 < sulix> Oh dear...
+15:20 < sulix> The power of adobe!
+15:24 < matches> I bet the videos don't work either
+15:26 < sulix> What format are they in?
+15:26 < matches> mkv
+15:26 < matches> They work
+15:26 < matches> I guess it was too much to expect pdflatex to produce a valid pdf
+15:35 < Pommers> Latex PDF? Got it working yet?
+15:55 < matches> No
+15:56 < matches> I have narrowed it down to
+15:56 < matches> "Cannot include graphics in slides"
+15:56 < matches> Which will make for an amazing presentation
+15:58 < matches> Ah
+15:58 < matches> Adobe doesn't support including pdfs within pdfs
+15:58 < sulix> What!?
+15:59 < sulix> Man, I've included pdfs within pdfs in pretty much every assignment I've submitted ever.
+15:59 < matches> I don't know
+15:59 < matches> That's the first place it shits itself
+15:59 * sulix ponders whether or not this may have affected marks.
+15:59 < matches> Debugging by repeatedly commentint out bits of TeX and recompiling is not very efficient and/or fun
+16:00 < sulix> Worst comes to the worst, take screenshots of all of your slides, I guess...
+16:00 < sulix> (Or download a windows binary for evince/etc and put that on the thumb drive)
+16:02 < matches> Yeah I'm supposed to be registering now
+16:25 < Pommers> matches: Send me the tex source and I'll try
+--- Day changed Wed Oct 15 2014
+10:38 < matches> Frames compiled it for me on Windows, so I survived
+10:40 < Pommers> Yeah. That's what I was going to do
+10:40 * Pommers should really set up that build server properly
+13:18 < matches> I might have promised a Windows version in the talk...
+13:18 < matches> Also saving, loading
+13:18 < matches> And...
+13:18 < matches> Shading
+16:05 < matches> I wonder if I can hack in a "draw" mode...
+16:05 < matches> Now that the conference is over, ANYTHING IS POSSIBLE
+16:06 < matches> (Except there's only two weeks left)
+16:06 < matches> ... < 2 weeks left
+--- Day changed Sun Oct 19 2014
+14:48 < sulix> Far out: I'm looking up some IEEE GPU stuff, and Google keeps pointing me to your lit review.
+17:01 < matches> :S
+17:02 < matches> I need to muster the courage to write more of my report
+17:02 < matches> So tired
+--- Day changed Mon Oct 20 2014
+22:45 < sulix> So it turns out that the crazy multithreadedness of the control panel totally bollockses up the profiler.
+22:46 < sulix> Which explains the random crashing due to "impossible things happening" like "functions returning before their parents do".
+22:49 < sulix> The everything gets bollocksed when adding text bug is also fixed.
+22:50 < sulix> The magical invisible turtles bug remains.
+22:51 * sulix wonders if he should see the teenage mutant ninja turtles movie for an explaination.
+23:48 < sulix> For reasons unknown, I'm generating a lot of quadtree overlays with the exact same objects in them.
+23:48 < sulix> By which I mean the same {object_begin, object_end} pairs.
+23:49 < sulix> So lots of things are being rendered ~40 times, and many things aren't being rendered at all.
+23:51 < sulix> Actually, never mind, I'm just printing out the wrong thing in my debug statement.
+--- Day changed Tue Oct 21 2014
+00:48 * sulix has a lot of writing to do tommorrow.
+00:48 < sulix> By which I mean today.
+09:02 * sulix ->sainity--
+09:30 < Pommers> Morning
+11:07 < matches> :(
+11:11 * sulix has engaged "panic mode"
+11:12 < Pommers> Can you try and shake it off? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nfWlot6h_JM
+11:12 < sulix> Also "holy shit, I don't have any results other than SIGSEGV" mode.
+11:20 < matches> I wish I hadn't read the comments on that video
+11:24 < matches> I'm having trouble understanding the metaphor
+11:24 < matches> Is Taylor Swift meant to be the thesis or me
+11:25 < matches> And how is the illuminati involved
+11:28 < Pommers> Never read YT comments
+11:28 < Pommers> Metaphor? Th[4~esis? Illuminati?
+11:34 < matches> "Haters gonna hate" would be me hating the thesis, but the thesis being an inanimate and currently purely digital object would be unable to shake itself
+11:35 < matches> According to the comments Taylor Swift is in the illuminati
+11:35 < sulix> The only shaking I can imagine is the solemn shaking of heads.
+11:35 < matches> :(
+11:35 < Pommers> Or
+11:36 < Pommers> Does your thesis hatre you, hence it's not happening
+11:36 < Pommers> and therefore you need to shake it off?
+11:36 < matches> Perhaps the clue is in the name, in that we need to Swiftly apply Taylor series to things
+11:38 < sulix> matches: That is the only consistent interpretation.
+11:38 < matches> I regret catching up on 6 weeks of lectures instead of working on the thesis
+11:40 < matches> http://www.irregularwebcomic.net/374.html
+11:40 < sulix> http://phdcomics.com/comics/archive.php?comicid=1749
+11:42 < matches> Back to it I guess
+11:42 < matches> By which I mean back to spending 30 minutes mentally preparing myself to go back to it
+11:43 < Pommers> While you relax
+11:43 < Pommers> You could fix NTP on your laptop
+11:46 < sulix> better still, set the time to three days ago so that you have more time to work on the thesis.
+11:47 < Pommers> Thats's a good idea! Just avoid anything that relies on time
+11:49 < sulix> The number of sudden thoughts about much better ways to do this project is slightly terrifying.
+12:44 < sulix> /me suspects he's deleted more than he's written.
+13:02 < sulix> Someone's looked at quadtrees for "infinite bitmaps": http://programmers.stackexchange.com/questions/104609/infinite-bitmap
+13:44 < sulix> Knuth apparently does not like the term "mantissa". He has quite a rant about it and now I'm feeling guilty for using it.
+13:47 < matches> Let's face it, Knuth won't read our work, and if he does, he won't like it
+13:48 < sulix> I had a nightmare where Kahan was berating me for not understanding floats.
+13:49 < matches> You don't even need to write about floats? Do you?
+13:49 < matches> Also, should I be urgently producing graphs of how slow rationals are
+13:50 < matches> I have 6662 words, but this is really not good
+13:51 < sulix> I'm sort-of leaving the "results" section blank at the moment.
+13:51 < matches> Wait but what else do you need?
+13:51 < matches> Lit Review should be done*
+13:52 < matches> There is a "Methods" chapter which I'm a bit embarressed about
+13:52 < sulix> Also, I should push the "speed up everything because it was dodgy renderrange code that was taking >90% the time" fix at some point.
+13:52 < matches> How badly would pulling break everything...
+13:52 < sulix> I've been writing up how the quadtree works, and fixing up the lit review, intro, gpu float bits, etc.
+13:53 < sulix> Well, I don't think I've been brave enough to push yet, but probably it will break everything.
+13:53 < sulix> Though, with some small amount of luck, it should still compile.
+13:56 * sulix has pushed. Time to warm up your "git revert" commands.
+13:57 < sulix> Also I need to write up about how rationals can represent more things than the quadtree, which can only represent binary fractions.
+14:18 < matches> "A naive approach would be to simply replace all floating point operations with arbitrary precision operations, and this is in fact what we did before we realised how stupid that was"
+14:21 < sulix> I was going for "A naïve approach would be to simply replace all floating point operations with arbitrary precision operations, and unlike the quatreethulu, that does actually work."
+14:21 < matches> How do you get the ï in LaTeX
+14:22 < sulix> \"i
+14:22 < matches> Thankyou
+14:25 < matches> Is there a good reference I can cite for how shaders work...
+14:25 < matches> I really don't want to or have the space to explain the OpenGL API
+14:25 < sulix> The OpenGL spec?
+14:25 < matches> I guess
+14:25 < sulix> Or ARB_vertex_program / ARB_shader_program
+14:25 < sulix> s/shader_program/fragment_program
+14:47 < matches> You know I am linking to the git repository in my report
+14:47 < matches> The one with all the "My eyes, they burn!" commit messages...
+14:48 < matches> I figured that the markers assuming there wasn't version control was marginally worse than them reading my commit messages
+14:48 < matches> But only marginally
+14:49 * sulix wipes some nervous sweat from his brow.
+14:50 < Pommers> What did you do for commit messages?
+14:50 < matches> Usually stuff to the effect of "This code is awful"
+14:50 < matches> "I didn't even design this!"
+14:50 < matches> Etc
+14:51 < sulix> Pommers: cover your eyes: http://git.ucc.asn.au/?p=ipdf/code.git;a=shortlog
+14:52 < sulix> My favourite is "A Song of Floodfills and Segfaults"
+14:52 < Pommers> haha
+15:11 < sulix> matches: Any idea why "bezier.h:61:20: error: call of overloaded ‘Abs(Gmprat)’ is ambiguous"
+15:13 < sulix> Also: "rect.h:21:13: error: no match for ‘operator<<’ (operand types are ‘std::basic_ostream<char>’ and ‘const IPDF::Rational<IPDF::Arbint>’)" if I try Rational<T>
+15:37 < matches> Aaaah
+15:37 < matches> It wasn't ambiguous when I last used it!
+16:03 * sulix squirms nervously.
+16:06 < matches> I finally made the performance test graphs
+16:06 < matches> They are kind of dodgy
+16:07 < sulix> Ooh... show me.
+16:13 < matches> http://szmoore.net/ipdf/sam/figures/time.pdf
+16:13 < matches> http://szmoore.net/ipdf/sam/figures/memory.pdf
+16:13 < matches> It's using eye_of_the_rabbit.script
+16:14 < matches> It keeps track of how much memory is used for the View width
+16:14 < matches> And how long it takes to do each cycle that involves adding 3 rabbits seperated by 1e-3 or whatever it was
+16:14 < matches> A totally arbitrary test but hey, the graph is linear
+16:15 < matches> I'm pretty fed up with this project at this point
+16:15 < matches> Words are on the page
+16:16 < matches> It's amazing how much less you have to write when you remove the "TODO: I really should explain this properly"
+16:19 < sulix> Those are with the Gmprat for path bounds, doubles? for beziers?
+16:21 < matches> Gmprat for path bounds
+16:21 < matches> Not really much point doing it for anything else
+16:21 < matches> Since anything else won't render the images correctly
+16:21 < matches> I guess I should do it for doubles as well
+16:22 < matches> Actually doubles would be able to render that particular script correctly
+16:22 < matches> For a long time
+16:23 < sulix> The quadtree can render it correctly until there is more than one rabbit.
+16:23 < sulix> Also eye_of_the_rabbit is cpu rendered by default, no?
+16:24 < matches> Yeah I changed it to make that test
+16:24 < sulix> Okay.
+16:24 < matches> I'll run it for mpfr-1024 path
+16:24 < matches> I've had enough of having to tweak things to recompile the software...
+16:25 < matches> So I'm limited to the binaries I already have and they have a habit of sigfpe'ing
+16:26 < matches> Oh, it was also done with the window hidden
+16:26 < sulix> By choice or by fglrx?
+16:26 < matches> By choice
+16:31 < matches> Urgh this project is dumb
+16:31 < matches> I really don't want to have to repeat my final year project :S
+17:17 < matches> How do you like being referred to as "Gow"
+17:17 < matches> Also it's been an hour or so without me saying this project is silly
+17:17 < matches> So I'll say it again
+17:18 < matches> I ended up putting the Circles on CPU/GPU in my "Lit Review" part...
+17:18 < matches> Because it just fit a lot better underneath the section that was actually talking about it
+17:18 < matches> Rather than in the results
+17:19 < matches> "By the way we did some circles too"
+17:19 < matches> I feel like I should say something snarky about the naive method not being worthy of publication...
+17:19 < matches> That might be a bad idea
+17:29 < matches> "Hi all, No doubt you are busy preparing your final report..."
+17:29 < matches> AAAAAHHH
+17:30 < matches> I don't know, there's only so much you can polish a turd..
+17:30 < matches> Holy shit how do I have 40 references
+17:30 < matches> I guess there was that "Look I read about GPUs [10 references]" paragraph
+17:31 < matches> Should I mention the arbitrary precision on GPU stuff
+17:31 < matches> Blargh
+17:41 < matches> "The main body of the report should be between 6,000 and 8,000
+17:41 < matches> words excluding appendices. (i.e. from the beginning of the
+17:41 < matches> Introduction to the end of the Conclusions/Future work section)."
+17:41 < matches> Finally found the word limit
+17:41 < matches> Dammit
+17:41 < matches> Here I was aiming for 6000 maximum...
+17:44 < matches> I can stick in the pointless sections about "Pixels or Perish" I guess
+17:44 < matches> Distract them with pretty pictures
+17:47 < matches> Takes me up to 46 references...
+17:47 < matches> And 6972 words
+17:47 < matches> Done
+17:48 < matches> Submit
+18:21 < sulix> I think your thesis is significantly better than mine.
+18:22 < sulix> Mostly because it has more results and less "TODO"
+18:26 * sulix seeps into a 20 minute come.
+18:26 < sulix> s/come/coma
+18:26 < sulix> (The state of my brain is becoming more and more evident)
+18:55 < matches> (The trick is to delete the TODOs)
+--- Day changed Wed Oct 22 2014
+12:50 < matches> ECM sent me an email about 2015 Final Year Project preferences...
+12:50 < matches> NO
+12:50 < matches> I already did this!
+12:50 < matches> They also sent me an email about submitting vacation work reports
+12:50 < matches> I didn't do that yet!
+12:51 < matches> This is what you get for totally ignoring the recommended degree progression
+17:17 < Pommers> Guess who has card access through the main door for CS xD
+17:18 * sulix is filled with a jealous rage.
+17:20 < Pommers> hehehehe
+17:20 < Pommers> Pretty sure I now have more Access to CS than both of you :D
+17:54 < matches> They'll probably be glad they get to revoke our access at the end of the year
+17:54 < matches> Doing other assignments is a nice distraction from the project although in terms of time investment it is not wise
+17:54 < matches> In terms of time investment the correct approach is to fail everything else
+17:55 < matches> Although that didn't work so well last semester
+17:55 < matches> (I didn't actually fail but my marks got consistently lower :(
+17:55 < matches> I don't know how to bracket that
+17:55 < matches> :()
+--- Day changed Thu Oct 23 2014
+18:12 < matches> My report scores a Flesch Reading Ease of 42.30
+18:12 < matches> Which is higher than "university graduate" and lower than "13 to 15 year old students"
+18:13 < matches> It scores a Flesch-Kincaid Grade of 12.44
+18:13 < matches> I guess that means it is high school level...
+18:13 < matches> That isn't as reassuring as I'd hoped...
+18:14 < matches> At least I'm beating "an average 6th grade assignment"
+18:17 < matches> My physics thesis is 39.90 and 12.99 indicating my writing has gotten dumber, as expected
+18:19 < matches> Yours is at 46.06 and 11.39
+18:19 < matches> The question is, what should we be aiming for...
+18:21 < matches> That was an interesting but not particularly productive diversion into readability of documents
+18:21 < matches> (I think the most this test can conclusively say is that we did indeed write some words)
+18:21 < matches> (Many of which had more than one syllable)
+19:40 * sulix shall have words with "an arbitrary number of syllables" in his thesis.
+19:41 < sulix> Also, it turns out printperf has a big #ifdef QUADTREE_DISABLED around it.
+19:41 < sulix> Which explains much.
+19:59 < sulix> Did you know: when rendering with GMPrat, sometimes the debug text displays the bounds as being totally wrong for a frame, and then they're back to normal.
+20:00 * sulix has found something even more fun than watching paint dry: watching gmprat render.
+20:16 * sulix now has a graph: http://davidgow.net/stuff/ipdf-gmpqttest1.pdf
+20:54 < matches> Cool
+21:16 < matches> That looks very similar to the turtles graph I just got
+21:16 < matches> Except qtree isn't on it
+21:16 < matches> Path-gmprat is my favourite
+21:29 < matches> Ok, I know it's only 9:28 but my clock says 5:28
+21:29 < matches> So that counts as bed time
+21:30 * matches tries not to think about the asignment due tomorrow or the 3 weeks of assignments that need to be marked before students start to hate me
+21:30 < matches> Or, for that matter, how he is going to explain Quantum Mechanics...
+21:31 < matches> Or CoderDojo...
+21:31 < matches> I must be getting old
+21:31 < matches> Back in 2012 I could work on my thesis until 5am and still be awake enough to do my other assignments :S
+21:32 < matches> That might be a slight exagerration, I think there was a large amount of feeling like death involved
+21:36 < matches> I used to know the quantum number selection rules off by heart too...
+21:41 < matches> Ahh, the amazing HTML formatting of the quantum mechanics webpage
+21:41 < matches> The memories
+--- Day changed Sat Oct 25 2014
+11:26 * sulix will not be able to make coderdojo today, for obvious reasons.
+11:26 < matches> Ok, good luck
+17:39 -!- sulix [
[email protected]] has quit [Quit: So long and thanks for all the ghoti]
+--- Log opened Sun Oct 26 14:54:49 2014
+14:54 -!- Irssi: #ipdf: Total of 4 nicks [1 ops, 0 halfops, 0 voices, 3 normal]
+14:54 -!- Irssi: Join to #ipdf was synced in 3 secs
+14:55 < matches> Very much in the "The referencing doesn't produce ?? submit it" phase
+14:57 < matches> Ah crap the referencing still produces ??
+14:57 < matches> But only in the appendix...
+15:50 < matches> I get to submit this to a "Printerface"
+15:50 < matches> Oh ho ho
+15:53 * sulix has had the joy of having to redo his data with vblank off.
+15:54 < sulix> Also, the random flickering bug is actually showing up in the graphs
+16:02 < matches> Yuk
+16:03 < matches> So you have loads of data now though?
+16:03 < matches> I had vague plans of redoing graphs and then apathy happened
+16:03 < sulix> Yeah, lots and lots of graphs and numbers.
+16:03 < matches> Cool
+16:04 < matches> I just have like, 3...
+16:04 < sulix> I extended the profiler to also output the number of objects in the document and rendered
+16:04 < sulix> (Well, I only have 3 interesting graphs)
+16:05 < sulix> The quadtree spens 23.7% of its time generating new nodes.
+16:05 < sulix> (In case you cared)
+16:05 < matches> Only 23.7%?
+16:05 < sulix> Yup.
+16:06 < sulix> It generates at total (during the zoom-in-on-grid test for 800 frames) of 219 nodes.
+16:06 < sulix> And clips a total of 6559 objects
+16:07 < matches> I'll email what I have.
+16:07 < matches> Prepare to be whelmed.
+16:07 < matches> Oh dear I just quoted *that* movie
+16:09 < sulix> I'll email mine when I've finished regenerating all of the graphs and stats with non-vblanked data.
+16:10 < sulix> (The quadtree is now officially 2127 times faster than naïve use of GMP rationals)
+16:12 < matches> I think naive use of GMP rationals is a slightly unfair benchmark... :P
+16:12 < matches> But it'll make for impressive graphs
+16:12 < sulix> The requested URL /sam/ipdf/thesis.pdf was not found on this server.
+16:13 < matches> /ipdf/sam/thesis.pdf
+16:13 < matches> Also attached it to the email
+16:13 -!- Irssi: #ipdf: Total of 4 nicks [1 ops, 0 halfops, 0 voices, 3 normal]
+16:13 < sulix> Also, "Wintrhop Professor".
+16:13 < matches> Oh boy
+16:14 < matches> Wait where does it even say that...
+16:14 < matches> Oh
+16:14 < matches> The damn letter
+16:19 < matches> Yeah going by the rubric I think I'll have a solid 1/4 average
+17:05 < sulix> Again, the closer this project is to being due, the more interesting mathematical things I'm finding that I wish I'd seen earlier.
+17:06 * sulix slips a small reference to the Riemann Zeta function into a footnote.
+17:23 < matches> I'm concerned about the lack of interesting mathematical things in my thesis, footnote or otherwise
+17:24 < matches> I think I'm allowed to call it a thesis since that's what I was supposed to put on the "letter"
+17:25 < matches> You can't diss this ertation
+17:25 < matches> That worked in my head
+17:25 < matches> synonyms..
+17:25 < matches> monograph
+17:26 < matches> disquisition
+17:26 < matches> disquietening
+17:26 < matches> composition
+17:26 <@bobgeorge33> When does Tim officailly start work again?
+17:26 < matches> in the key of F# minor
+17:26 < matches> Um
+17:26 < matches> Next year?
+17:27 < matches> Someone has to write a "supervisor report"
+17:29 < matches> Well, I at least have lots of words
+17:29 < matches> Too many to proof read
+18:07 < matches> It has been submitted to the Printer Face
+18:07 < matches> Good luck sulix
+18:10 * sulix solemnly nods: "Good luck to us all!"
+23:34 < sulix> It is done: http://davidgow.net/stuff/DavidFYPThesis.pdf
+23:38 <@bobgeorge33> When are they due?
+23:42 <@bobgeorge33> Lastly, as a double degree student I need to
+23:42 <@bobgeorge33> express a double degree of thanks to my friends and family for their continued patience whilst I
+23:42 <@bobgeorge33> completed my second “final year” project in what is technically a penultimate year.
+23:42 <@bobgeorge33> Very nice
+--- Day changed Mon Oct 27 2014
+08:46 < matches> They're due at 12:00pm
+09:00 < matches> Hmm, there are only a few highly wrong statements in my thesis
+09:01 < matches> To resubmit or not to resubmit
+09:03 < matches> I keep thinking I really need more detail and then I realise it's 9000 words...
+09:03 < matches> What did I even say in those 9000 words I don't even
+09:04 < matches> In other news it's 9:04 and no one is at my tutorial...
+09:05 < matches> I was going to show them CQM animations
+09:09 < matches> Curses a student
+09:09 < matches> (I don't know what I want)
+10:15 * sulix resubmits to fix the typo in the latin reference that Tim disconvered.
+10:16 < sulix> I've also added the original proposal as an Appendix because apparently I'm meant to, though it does sort-of highlight how little of it I've actually done.
+10:19 * sulix proceeds to collapse from exhaustion.
+10:44 -!- Netsplit mussel.ucc.au.uniirc.com <-> arctic.uniirc.com quits: @bobgeorge33
+10:45 -!- Netsplit over, joins: @bobgeorge33
+11:11 -!- Netsplit mussel.ucc.au.uniirc.com <-> arctic.uniirc.com quits: @bobgeorge33
+11:12 < matches> Aaaand
+11:12 < matches> LMS is being LMS
+11:13 -!- Netsplit over, joins: @bobgeorge33
+11:13 < matches> UWA is having problems?
+11:13 < matches> Trying to resubmit to Printer Face
+11:13 < matches> Not sure if I am now going to end up with two copies...
+11:14 < matches> The second copy is slightly less vague
+11:14 < matches> I guess people can work out that they need to read IEEE to get the full gory details of the encodings and stuff
+11:15 < matches> Also people can probably work out the legends on my graphs if they think
+11:15 < matches> Also there is like, wierd functional programming notation in Tim and Rowan's emails
+11:15 < matches> Is it a secret code?
+11:23 < matches> AAAH SHIT
+11:23 < matches> My last commit is going to be at 7:23pm
+11:23 < matches> I'll get in trouble for using a time machine to submit it before 12:00pm
+11:40 -!- Netsplit mussel.ucc.au.uniirc.com <-> arctic.uniirc.com quits: @bobgeorge33
+11:42 -!- Netsplit over, joins: @bobgeorge33
+11:42 < matches> Well, that as anticlimactic
+11:43 < matches> The whole having 3 other assignments due this week thing sort of ruins it
+11:51 -!- Netsplit mussel.ucc.au.uniirc.com <-> arctic.uniirc.com quits: @bobgeorge33
+11:51 -!- Netsplit over, joins: @bobgeorge33
+11:53 < matches> I actually really don't trust someone else to print my assignment :S
+11:53 < matches> Who is this Printer and why does it have a Face
+11:54 < matches> What if the inline postscript gets interpreted by the driver as actual postscript and it just prints 40 pages of shape.eps
+11:54 < matches> Aaaah
+11:56 <@bobgeorge33> What happens if it decides to print 100 copies instead of 1 and they aren't collated!
+11:59 * matches stabs
+12:01 < matches> sulix: "Programmme"
+12:01 < matches> Does it have three mmm like that
+12:01 < sulix> Um... it does now.
+12:02 < matches> I approve
+12:02 < sulix> I am a programmmmmmer
+12:03 -!- Netsplit mussel.ucc.au.uniirc.com <-> arctic.uniirc.com quits: @bobgeorge33
+18:38 -!- bobgeorge33 is now known as Pommers
+--- Day changed Thu Oct 30 2014
+13:45 < matches> sulix: Is there going to be a meeting about your presentation? Should I come, or stay away?
+14:16 < sulix> I don't think there's going to be a meeting... I've got another research project due at 4:00, so I'll be doing that.
+14:16 < sulix> The seminar schedule is out now, though: http://undergraduate.csse.uwa.edu.au/year4/Current/Project/seminarTimetable.html
+14:17 < sulix> It's hysterically empty.
+14:28 < matches> Baha
+14:29 < matches> 25 minutes, ew
+14:29 < matches> Good luck
+14:29 < sulix> You're welcome to come along to the talk if you hate sleep.
+14:29 < matches> I will try and come
+14:30 < matches> "Time travel debugging"...
+14:30 < sulix> Yeah, Ben's a genius.
+14:30 < matches> I do that all the time though
+14:30 < matches> (With printf statements)
+14:30 < sulix> But you live in the future.
+14:30 < matches> (And scrolling through the output with less)
+14:30 < matches> That too
+14:31 < matches> Don't worry, your abstract sounds really cool too
+--- Day changed Sat Nov 01 2014
+10:27 < matches> I guess we're done here, good job
+--- Day changed Tue Nov 04 2014
+14:30 < matches> We will leave this channel here until the marks come out
+--- Day changed Sat Nov 08 2014
+23:00 -!- Pommers is now known as bobgeorge33
+23:00 -!- bobgeorge33 is now known as Pommers
+--- Day changed Tue Nov 11 2014
git.ucc.asn.au / ipdf / documents.git / blobdiff
UCC git Repository :: git.ucc.asn.au